. >> it is more than shuttings down the government if they don't raise the debt ceiling there are so many people expecting payments veterans, soldiers, the --. melissa: but they get to decide who they pay and they don't. they could decide to pay those people and -- >> a lot harder, very, very hard to decide who they pay and who they don't. logistics are total nightmare. there are billions upon billions of computerized payments. if you want to code it and figure out how you get money to certain people and not others that sound like a catastrophe. it could happen when they even threatened not to raise the debt ceiling around our credit was downgraded and the markets really tumbled. you don't want to i can take the chance. no way the republicans would take that chance. melissa: maybe you don't. a nit is very risk-averse person? >> in poker a 19 is someone that folds every hand. they wait for the perfect chance to get money in. problem is nits never win tournaments. they have to actually risk something in order to see that value. melissa: who is the nit in this? >> everyone. they're all